How To Think Like An 8 Figure Entrepreneur.

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Introduction

Intro (00:00)

But if you really like keep it simple, then it's like, hey, I'm gonna do this. I'm gonna try a bunch of shit. I may fail. I may make a billion. Hey, who cares?

Early Life And Entrepreneurial Journey

Who is Serge... (00:06)

Let's go. I think a lot of people don't spend enough time assessing whether their thoughts from previous upbringing or previous people in their life. It's whatever it is, right? There's tons of experiences you have in life that condition you. Becoming a good thinker comes from becoming a good observer. You cannot build a great organization while trying to survive. Impossible. In order for you to build a seven-figure company, you need to build a platform that delivers seven figures worth. In order to make a living and you have that outcome tied to it now, you're outcome dependent, it loses, it's no longer a passion. It's not a hobby. It's like, it's survival. So Serge, why do you think that most business owners fail to scale their business?

Did you Realize Entrepreneurship Means Hard Work? (00:44)

I think that bottom extends from them not understanding that they need to track data or they need to track the activities that they're putting in every day. So a lot of founders, when you get started, the reason why you'll succeed is actually mostly from volume of activities, right? So you do everything and anything and something ends up working. But the issue is that that's not a scalable process where you can just keep doing more and more and more because your time at some point is just maxed out. So eventually you need to start tracking all the activities and base it off of each channel channel and then look at which one over performs or performs better and then cut out everything else and just focus on the one thing so it's so it's almost like an activity of like you do a bunch of tests and it takes up a lot of your time but then eventually you need to look at all the tests and look at okay which one performs the best and then everything else you just shut it down so founders who aren't tracking their their metrics and their their volume then you can't really make that decision of knowing what to cut out so they keep doing everything and sometimes they forget to do the right things so they don't get the right results i'm a very like right-brained person for example if i'm still very creative but struggling with logical tasks and so for a business owner who finds himself in that same kind of position, how would you give them advice to approach being able to be more numbers-oriented? So, I mean, it depends on where you're going, right? I started, you know, recently focusing on something which is like, you could try to get better at something or you could just look at where you're trying to take your company if you're trying to make it scale into multiple seven figures eight figures then the best path is probably not you becoming something that you're not it's probably just finding someone who you can hire to do the thing because even if you spend time becoming better at that thing it's like, that's only scalable to a certain point. Eventually, you'll need to stop doing it. Because if you're trying to scale, you're not going to scale by doing everything that is right. You're just going to stick to doing what actually is what you like doing, you know? So don't force yourself. I mean, as an example, I don't necessarily build the systems. Even though I'm talking about let's track data, I'm not the one tracking it because I wouldn't want to do it in my company, right? So start with the end in mind and just reverse engineer who needs to be in your organization to do the thing you don't want done, but make sure that it's being done for sure. Cool. We had a really good conversation last night over dinner about finding the right people to delegate decision making to so i'd love to just dive into that a little bit you know like what is your thought process with that what challenges have you faced let's just let's get into that yeah um i'm in this situation where it's like there's a lot of things that i know how to like to scale the business I know how to do it but it's not knowing it is not gonna make it happen right so you get to a point where you're like I'm actually listening while coming here to this podcast from the guy you mentioned Alex I've been just going down deep into his pot okay crazy right and he talks about this process where the reason why you know which I just mentioned a little bit it's like to go from zero to one comes from just busy work. You get conditioned to do a lot of work to be the hustler. Right. But in order for you to go from one to ten, you need to uncondition yourself to this condition, which is like, oh, the way I get successful is I come up with an idea and I implement today. Right. You tell me about this guy, Alex, who talks about operations. I get back home. I listen to a podcast by him and that's just to research a bunch of stuff and then I'm probably gonna want to take do the thing that he's mentioning but you know what an eight-figure person would probably not do that or a nine-figure person it would just be like hey guys I think this guy is someone you guys should be listening to please go learn everything is teaching absolutely so but the mistake that i've made um or that at least i'm learning as i go is don't hire from potential don't hire for potential hire for experience so don't look at someone be like oh wow this person could potentially be good no it's like hey have you done this before and show me the roadmap to getting there because when you start hiring for potential it becomes so intensive and so there's so much pressure on you because you need to do the thing you were already doing and you also need to lift up everyone because they're like they have the potential but they don't know shit so it's like now you're doing the work and you also have to at the same time teach them how to do the works it's like right that's where people that's where it's like the gap to go from a million a year or a few millions a year to like past eight figures it's insanely hard right because it's it's counter intuitive it's like oh to i got here by doing a lot of thing having a lot of control but to get to the next level i have to give up control and that's like it's it's it tears you up from within so that's why it's like hey don't hire if the person hasn't done it before because if you do that you're gonna go through a lot of pain you know right yeah yeah and that's uh you know that's one of the things that i've really grown to appreciate about you is that you're just you've become very good at thinking. And I think that's a very underrated skill to have. I think a lot of people don't spend enough time assessing whether their thoughts from previous upbringing or previous people in their life, it's whatever it is, right? There's tons of experiences you have in life that condition you. And a lot of people do not focus on the deprogramming and reversing that conditioning and and that's exactly what we're talking about it's just like you need to do that in order to get to the next level a lot of people get stuck there thousand percent and i think becoming a good thinker comes from becoming a good observer right because if you don't look at if you don't observe things and see different insights you're not really going to change or change your thought process.

You need to be a Good Thinker from Traps from the Past (06:30)

So as an example, like for me, I just like to look at, you know, we're talking about maybe it could be a good next subject is like building an audience. Right. So as an example, as you know, we help businesses grow. We know the Facebook ad, we know the funnels, we know the follow upup we know the importance of creating you know intent in the prospect to buy we know all these things we know whatever hook people on a video blah blah blah blah blah right mm-hmm but you need to look at yourself and be like okay but why am I not scaling yeah and the way you look at why you're not scaling well you need to look at someone who's scaled.

Radical Leverage (07:25)

Right. And then you need to reverse engineer and look at, okay, but where are they spending most of their time? What are they doing? Right. Not, oh, how can I get better at Facebook ad? Because if you keep trying to just get scaling the scale, like, oh, I need to just get good at these like little little like scales like these verticals of like just specific scale that's not really how you scale because at some point a specific scale and apply to the wrong leverage is also not leveraged applying facebook ad to brick and mortar business okay cool the biggest case study you'll ever have is like okay you got them a few leads a few deals a month but if you apply to let's say a product that has zero marginal cost like an info product or right like a sass then that case study that same skill applied to that becomes a nine-figure potentially a nine-figure scale absolutely right yeah so we were talking about you know something that i've been observing lately um i was listening to this podcast uh my first million and they had the guy derrick from more more plates more dates and um they said that you know they guessed that he was making like around six to seven six to eight million a month and for me like when I heard that, I was like, come on, what? That's insane. And for me, it threw me off of this thing, which is like, this is like now I understand the importance of content and building an audience. Right. Because if this guy is just creating content, you know, talking about fitness supplements and maybe creating some entertaining entertainment stuff on YouTube. And he's built able to build behind that audience and brand that brands that generates him like almost nine figures a year mm-hmm and then you have on this side a bunch of smart-ass entrepreneurs who can't even make ten grand a month like for me it's like whoa but like how does this add up so like it creates a little it just doesn't make sense for me. And then it creates an even more urgency to doing the thing that that is creating the success for him, at least, which is like the audience. Then attach whatever you can want and you're going to scale faster than the brightest entrepreneurs and smartest marketers. Right. So, yeah.

Subscriptions And Schemes (09:42)

Yeah. And that's a very, very good point. um you know and and yeah we when we were talking about that i was thinking about that a lot you know after after dinner i was just reflecting on that i'm like this actually doesn't make sense like this is like an unfair advantage this audience thing right it's like uh you know you have people doing all the traditional things cold outreach ads all of these traditional acquisition mechanisms, but they're not providing the same return, not even in the same ballpark, you know, to get to six to 7 million a month. Insane. How would you even put in the inputs, right? We're talking about tracking. It's like, what the fuck would those numbers look like? Right. But with an audience, it just, it really creates this unfair advantage, which I think, you know, it's like, why wouldn't you, why wouldn't you start building your audience? Yeah. So, you know, just's like, why wouldn't you? Why wouldn't you start building your audience? Yeah. So, you know, just an idea. So I was working for, my last job was, you know, like three years ago was working at a Goodfood, right? And they were probably spending like a lot of money, like millions and millions of dollars per month on ads. And, you know, with when the pandemic happened, like they got a spike in sales because more people would buy. they don't want to go to the grocery store whatever but like imagine that type of business behind a brand of someone who's a chef with like a million subs on youtube they would never have to advertise right and it was a subscription, a weekly subscription. I think they scaled to like half a billion in revenue a year. But they worked crazy hard on advertising. But it's like that business versus you have find an actual like influencer or someone with an audience and then you attach that type of offer. Then like the retention on on such a subscription is just way greater than if you just acquire someone on utility meaning because the main selling points are like oh don't go to the grocery store don't cook yourself cook yourself or whatever it's like utility it's like they're saving you time it's convenience but if you attach a brand a personal brand, people are not buying convenience anymore. People are buying you. So whatever you put out, even if it's expensive, people are going to buy because they want to do business with you. So now the sales angle, it doesn't need to exist. Right. Yeah, it's so true. And when you think about it in a grandiose way, you think about the biggest influencers, you know, or even the ones that everyone will recognize, like Kim Kardashian, you know, she's telling you to go buy skims. Like, you're going to go buy it. It doesn't matter. You're not worried about the quality of the fabric. You're not worried about any of those things. You're just like, well, Kim said to do it. I'm going to do it. Yeah. Right. So that's why, you know, the ladies go crazy for the Kardashians and the Jenners. They'll just do it like, they're like why uh you know the ladies uh go crazy for the kardashians and the jenners they'll just do it like they're like okay you have beautiful lips i want lips like that like what are you using oh you're selling this okay i got it you know so yeah um yeah really interesting point that you guys touched on yesterday that would be great to get into was mimetic desire yeah that conversation get started yesterday I think I think Nick was asking me like hey what is the end goal like I guess with the company mm-hmm and I was just saying the fact that you know as much as I want to play the game and I want to become good I also don't want to get lost in the copying other people's goals and dreams and lifestyle.

Behaviour Around Desire (12:47)

Right. I want to just play the game my way. Like, I'm still going to work. I love getting up and just learning the next thing, learning how to build a team and learn how to scale. But at some point, I think I'm going to get to a point where I'm like, OK, cool, guys, this is enough. Let's just do what we want to do. Let's not play the, oh, I want to get to nine figure a year. I want to become a billionaire. play the i want to get to nine figure a year i want to become a billionaire like right i don't care i'm not going to copy your goals because because everyone literally like if you look at if you look at how the mark i mean just look at the marketing industry you start adding captions on your videos everybody adds them you starthmm you start you start giving away free stuff everybody does it mm-hmm you start marketing a certain way you start doing podcast you start doing you start wanting to become a nine-figure person everybody's like oh I want to hit nine figures mm-hmm everybody gets an exit everybody wants an exit it's true everybody wants to get 200k a month oh you feel like until I hit 100k a month I'm not worth shit.

Hit $100K a Month. (14:03)

I'm like, no. Like, you guys are just around copying people's desires. It's not really even your own desire. We're just copying people all around. So when you lack the awareness around your desires, you end up just going through the spiral of just chasing things and things and things and things, and it never ends. Right. You know, that kind of that brought a thought in my mind, because it's kind of funny, it comes almost full circle. It's like, you know, entrepreneurs, typically, it's like you might be working a job a nine to five, and you hate it because you're getting up early, you're sitting in traffic, you're commuting somewhere, you're going to an office or whatever the job is that you're doing. And you want to escape this cycle. And you're you're feel like you're stuck in the rat race. But then, you know, what happens is you end up kind of repeating the process when you get into like, entrepreneurship is the biggest rat race. Biggest one.

Rat Race of Entrepreneurship (15:00)

Biggest one. You end up entering that. And then, like to your point it's like it never ends because there's always someone bigger and better than you so it's just like your constant it's like when when is enough enough like when you know and i think that's a very personal question you need to ask yourself um you know everybody you need to evaluate like what is what is the point that i want to reach and like when am i gonna feel accomplished because i think that's a big problem with entrepreneurs it's like sometimes you just feel like you're never enough you know yeah yeah super important to design what you want you know and it's it's not like what you want is not going to be influenced by something else either it's like it will just be influenced by something but at least choose it like choose your desire so as, I like cars. And maybe me liking cars probably came from me seeing someone, you know, or at least experiencing somewhat, looking at a persona or a character who was living the life I wanted and maybe they were driving nice cars. But it's like, oh, I'm totally aware. And if I like Porsche, it's because I probably see someone, an entrepreneur who is living this specific life that I want to live. If they drive a Porsche, I'm going to go Porsche, it's because I probably see someone, an entrepreneur who is living this specific life that I wanna live. If they drive a Porsche, I'm gonna go Porsche, right? But I also don't run around just being like, oh, I like nice cars, let me go get, no. It's like, no, I want it and I choose it. And I'm totally aware that it's been influenced by this other person, but I'm not gonna go around chasing these, like hustling around just to try to chase a figure because because that's the thing that makes you like puts you on a certain pedestal in society no like no i'm gonna play this game my my way and i don't care if you if if i represent something cool or not like i'm just gonna play this game i'm gonna be cool at doing shit my way making the least amount of money doing my way you know so yeah i love nick that you said um entrepreneurship is the real rat race and a lot of entrepreneurs get into entrepreneurship to quote unquote escape the matrix and i heard someone say similar to something that you just said that entrepreneurship is the matrix right and a lot of people are under this impression that institutions want them to be part of like this industrialized manufacturing line and part of the cycle and part of the system. But these institutions want you even more to get into entrepreneurship and build product that's going to get taxed to millions of people and create additional income in the economy and create jobs and do everything else. That's pretty funny. Another story that really kind of speaks to the whole memetic desires thing. Before I get into it, Nick, if you don't mind, just so we can lead into the footage with, with Serge, do you mind kind of saying, um, the other day we talked about memetic desires, which is not explained what it is for like the layman's viewer. Absolutely. Um, yeah. So the other day we talked about mimetic desires and what that means is it's derived from the word mimic, which is to emulate or imitate other people's desires. So they, you know, they see something that someone else is doing and they're basically copying that unconsciously. They're not realizing that it's coming from somewhere else or someone else, but they're doing that involuntarily. that it's coming from somewhere else or someone else, but they're doing that involuntarily. And they think that they actually want that thing, but they don't realize that it's probably been influenced from someone else or something else. Awesome. Yeah. I saw this, I saw this story the other day and it kind of goes into not really understanding why we want the things we want. And we're just kind of following herd mentality. And it was talking about, they did this study where they put five monkeys in the room and there was a ladder in the room and at the top of the ladder there was a bushel of bananas and every single time a monkey would try to climb the ladder this very strong hose would go off and spray all the monkeys with freezing water and so the monkeys learned to not go up the ladder and grab the bananas now every few weeks they'd get rid of one of the monkeys and they'd put a new monkey in and so the monkey would get put in the room and he would try to go up to grab the bananas and all the other monkeys would grab him and pull him off and start beating him until he was bloody and bruised. And the monkey doesn't know why he's getting beaten. He doesn't know about the water, but he learns that he can't go for the bananas. And so every few weeks they would replace another monkey and the same exercise would happen until eventually none of the original monkeys were left in the room. But all of the monkeys knew that they were not allowed to climb the ladder and grab the bananas none of them knew about the water but they had adopted this herd mentality and this culture and the systemization um which really kind of plays into a lot of the stuff we do today like a lot of the things that we do on a daily basis, the rules we follow, the best practices we believe, whether it's to, you know, we have to be a lawyer or a doctor or an engineer to be successful. We don't even understand why a lot of these rules exist. We just know we have to follow them. And it's because of this kind of conditioning over generations and cycles, right? Yeah. Something Grant Cardone says is, I don't know, but he says that you have to ask yourself, hey, what are the beliefs that I believe in today that aren't true? Because if you don't question your beliefs, man, you can't grow because some things defy certain laws, bro.

How to grow past your wage (19:59)

So as an example, how can you really explain so if I just put into context like how do you explain to go from a 30k your job to like making 30k by like before you wake up same same human same brain same capabilities just different different just same time like maybe even less time invested like how do you explain that how do you explain that to someone who hasn't who hasn't done it yet you in order for you to go from where you're at right now to where you could be you you gotta stop believing what this person believes so it's like until you change your beliefs you will you will constantly just stay in the same position like just be and you think it's true and it's okay but it's like no you have to you have to question you have to question things you believe in like it should I be should I be selling my clients? Should I be supporting my clients doing one-on-one calls? Should I be leading the company? Am I the best person to be running it? Should we be selling just one high-ticket offer? Should I be just maybe selling people retainer only? Should I just focus on SaaS? No, like, there are no rules it's just a matter of like sequence but to be honest everything should be done in the right sequence but right it's but like it's not one thing it's like it's everything but in the right order right that's a very good point uh and i do, you know, I do totally think that sometimes we get caught up in our existing beliefs, and we just treat it like truth and fact. And we don't question that enough. We just feel like, okay, well, yesterday, or, you know, 10 years ago, or however, like, it's like these things I just I know to be true. So you don't question it. And that's probably, you know, it's a very scary thing with the human brain. And it's like, we need to learn to overcome those things and question, question everything, you know? Yeah. Okay. So yesterday at Dinner Surge, you mentioned that the most selfish thing that you can do is to be selfless.

Most selfish thing you can do is to be selfless (22:16)

What did you mean by that? selfless. What did you mean by that? So one of the things that you need to do as you scale is to kind of like find these, these little like rules, these values that allow, that allow others to behave congruently with, with the actions, like, because you can't always be there to tell someone like, hey, do this, do this, this is the right way. So you need to find values that lead their decision making. And I was coming up with the values for a client acquisition at IO. And, you know, a lot of people have these weird like values. It's almost similar. It's like they just have these corporate-y like type of values. And I was just trying to find something a little different. And I was like, I one of them was like The most self I need you to be self like I need you to be self it not and I know it was a The most selfish thing you can do is to be selfless, right? Because as you build a company people are selfish like for me. That's something that I'm not I don't lie to myself I'm selfish. My team is probably selfish. They're me, that's something that I'm not, I don't lie to myself. I'm selfish. My team is probably selfish. They're just thinking for them about themselves. So I inherently know like, hey, everyone is in it for themselves. So my goal is to try to not change them. I'm not going to change someone's selfishness. I mean, I can't do it. So, but instead I'm going to help them be selfish. And I needed a way for them to understand that, like, in order, if you really want to grow into this company, if you want to be taken care of, if you want to make the most amount of money in this organization, be selfless, don't think about yourself. Cause I never got paid because I thought of myself, I woke up and I'm like, okay, how can I get my clients meetings? How can those meetings be qualified? How can they show up more? How can they close faster? How can they make the most amount of money on each call that they take? And if I get the answers on behalf of my clients for those processes, then my clients are like, hey, you did all the work. Here is money. Then my clients are like, hey, you did all the work. Here is money. So, and then if I do that enough and I scale that, I make a shit ton more money than if I was just trying to figure out like, okay, how do I do this just for myself? You know? So, it's this idea around if you want the best for yourself, figure out a way to get the best for a lot of people. And that's where the value came from. Be like, you know what? The fastest way to get everything best for a lot of people. And that's where the, like the value came from be like, you know what? The fastest way to get everything you want is just think about others, give them whatever they want, do it effortlessly for them and, and do it faster than anybody else. And you're going to be taken care of in inevitably. So, right. Yeah. So that was where that thing came from. Yeah. I think that's um you know like you said i just i love that it's it's not corporate it's just like it's very real and i think that's that's ultimately why people like you i think is that you know you're you're down to earth you have your own kind of authenticity and people really vibe with that and as a younger leader too i think there's no need to be you I mean, you're still professional, but what I mean is like not corporate. So you don't need to be corporate, can be laid back, be casual and still get things done. And I think you've done a good job of proving that that's just as efficient as the corporate way to grow a company. So that's interesting.

How do you break old beliefs (25:43)

But I actually, I wanna go back to what we were previously talking about about these beliefs and breaking these beliefs i want to know from you like what have you done uh personally that you feel like has really helped break some of your old beliefs or how do you constantly challenge your beliefs what advice would you give to somebody that has old beliefs that they need to get rid of? Oh, that's a pretty hard thing to kind of like build a process around because you don't know what you don't know, right? Yeah. So how do you know which belief to break? You know, so, you know, you also don't want to go around breaking every belief, you know, like some beliefs actually serve you. But for me, one of the things that I do a lot and to be honest which has served me a lot I wouldn't say that it's about beliefs but it's about where do I source my information mmm right okay because if you stay in this little bubble of online marketers you get the same BS advice, right? And it's totally weird. So here's where marketers, I think, go wrong. Marketers focus too much on leading indicators, like just the flashy stuff, like how many views, how many appointments, how many leads are you getting, how many clients are you getting, right? But if you actually want to create insane amount of value you need to think you need to have a different view you need to start viewing the game like an investor right because an investor does not care about how many leads the people got he's caring about hey where is the lifetime value of each client and are we making more than we're investing to acquire that client so they have a they have a more of like a bird's eye view on the thing and not like super niche on the the metrics right right so for me a lot of the time when i'm learning a lot of stuff or at least the podcast that i listen to like i'll spend a lot of time or 80 of the knowledge that i get is mainly on like strategic stuff um you, what makes a company valuable? Like what is actual, what is valuable for someone? And I've had to like bring it down to the simplistic thing, which is everybody just wants, and let's just go back to like evolutionary psychology. People, and this is something that I got from, I don't know, yesterday I was listening to a podcast and I think taylor where to mention it but if you want to learn more about this read evolutionary psychology but there are really two things that people are seeking people or avoiding too people don't want to die and they don't want to be alone right that's it like life like everything we're doing everything like the reason why you wake up the reason why you go work anything is because you want to survive and you want to you want to

Why does legacy matter? (29:00)

be with someone and the reason why you want to be with someone is because you can so you can recreate and actually make your gene and there is this thing around in evolutionary psychology that says that like the main goal of your system of the gene is to recreate itself it does not care about anything besides hey we need to make sure that ourselves can get duplicated and get duplicated forever right now that's the basic those are the basic inherent like desires within us by the system whether you're smart dumb you're going to want to be alive you're going to want someone to be with you so you can actually reproduce right now you go a layer up and then then how do you how do you how do you achieve these goals well to survive you need a lot of resources how do you get a wife how do you get a mate well you need to be the best person you need to be the best choice on the marketplace that's why a tiny few percentage of men will get all the women and every the rest will just be competing on nothing some people won't even get anyone right so now all these men and I'm gonna use men because it's easier to kind of like explain right all these men create these games right like okay now how are we going to get the resources oh okay cool well we can go farm okay or i can go hunt oh okay cool well i'm tired of hunting how can you create technology now you start playing different type of games where the leverage changes so now we start playing this game of let's say we're marketers but but why are we marketers? Oh, okay, cool Let me build this business. Let me help these people save time money and then they're gonna exchange that resources They're gonna exchange money for the time. I just saved them then if I accumulate enough money I'm gonna have enough resources to be able to satisfy the survival and the mating needs Okay so and the mating needs mmm okay so really what it then it's about it's like okay now how do we how do we guarantee survival and like replication of our genes for lifetimes now it becomes about okay now how can we guarantee future resources right well you need a machine to create those resources in the future and what are the best path to wealth creation? It's owning organizations, it's creating companies. So now as an investor, an investor is really just wanting future cash flow. Right? Why? Well, because he just wants to make sure that his genes can live forever. Right? So now the investor is not really looking at, oh, how much money did I make this month? forever mm-hmm right yeah so now the investor is not really looking at oh how much money that make this month he cares about how much money am I gonna make tomorrow right and forever tomorrow's right so his thought process is not about oh how can I like he's not living today he's really living for like a century right or hundreds of years in the future so so when I when I when I end up what I end up learning is that oh well i actually need to stop thinking so much about like these little tiny games and actually need to start thinking about the long-term game so then when you start playing this game instead of like the the lower levels you start perceiving and making decisions that are completely different from what would be good today and instead you start playing the game for long term and you you make different decisions so for me it's like understanding like what's what's because if you really understand that these are also the main things that people want the way you market the way you position yourself is aligned with the subconscious desire and not the and not the like um the conscious desire like oh i need more leads i need more appointments i need to make 100k a month no you don't need to make 100k a month you need a shit ton of resources and you need to be able to get a penthouse so you can find a woman who so you can have a thousand women who want to be in the penthouse. Why does legacy matter? You're going to be dead. What is the evolutionary psychology behind why you're never satisfied with how much money you're making? Amazing.

Psychological Discussions: Love And Depression

Evolutionary psychology perspective (32:33)

Just got to say on an aside real quick, Serge, I love how eloquently you broke that down in terms of why people need to chase that huge accumulation of wealth from an evolutionary psychology perspective. It's such an interesting paradox because you just explained how it's for finding a mate and not being alone. But at the same time, entrepreneurship, you are working alone, sacrificing huge portions of your life, and you're gambling the two things that you're trying to go after on an evolutionary psychology perspective. And 99% of people aren't going to make it. It's the largest things that you're trying to go after on an evolutionary psychology perspective and 99% of people aren't going to make it. It's the largest gamble that people take in life. Something that's super interesting that I saw recently, I'm a musician, I love producing electronic music. And I always used to think that art, athletics was proof that there's more to life than just making money, extending your bloodline. That's proof that there's more to life than just making money extending your bloodline that's proof that there's a deeper meaning to life people aren't just competing in a marketplace and then an evolutionary psychologist broke this down for me and said no we've just become more sophisticated as humans and understood that there's more markets than just commerce right and so commerce has become over very oversaturated, like starting a marketing agency, starting a SaaS company.

Why we pursue love and relationships (33:35)

Um, all these high ticket offers are very oversaturated sources of income and everyone was, you know, building things and selling things and creating things. But then it was shown that there is a way to actually provide value and get paid for it through art, right? when we started monetizing on a very large scale whether it was music whether it was playing basketball whether it was doing any of these more creative things this simply became another marketplace for hierarchical domination and showing yourself as the best potential mate in a cohort, right? And so this desire to become the best musician or the best baseball player actually feeds into that same desire of being able to make the most money and being the best marketer or being the best advertiser. It's to be able to show yourself that you are the best potential candidate in the marketplace as well as to accumulate resources. Do you guys find that a little depressing that we're able to dumb down so many things from art to sports, for example, sports being a form of death distraction, to love, to evolutionary psychology baseline and just primitive instincts and chemicals. How do you guys feel about that? I don't, uh, you know, I don't find it too depressing to be honest, because I mean, we're all born to die. Like the purpose of life is to die. We're here. We came out to this planet and there's very few things in life that are sure and certain. Right. And one of them is death. You know, you're going to you know, there's like an old president that said something along the lines of the only thing in life that is sure is death and taxes. And you don't have to pay taxes anymore if you're smart. Yeah. So, you know, yeah, we're here to die. Yeah. So, you know, yeah, we're here to die. And as Serge was talking about from an evolutionary psychology standpoint, you know, we have a function in life and that's to pass on our bloodline, you know, and that life be possible today? As humans, that's like, that is our function. And I think, you know, it's very dumbed down, of course.

Human Psychology (36:08)

It's like a very one-dimensional way of, you know, and of thinking about it. Like there's obviously a lot more to life. You can get much more enrichment. It doesn't mean your life has to be depressing and it's like, oh, if, you know, I need to reproduce and then I'm gonna die. Like it's not like that, you know. You can really enjoy experiences, have a great partner, find a lot of fulfillment from many activities. But yeah, I mean, when you zoom out, when you look at it from that bird's eye view, just like an investor would look at a business, it's like when you look at it from the creator standpoint, whether you believe in God or some type of creator, like we came from something, whether it was science, like a big bang, or it's God or whatever you want to call it, we came from somewhere, there's of creator. We came from something, whether it was science, like a big bang, or it's God, or whatever you want to call it, we came from somewhere. There's a creator.

Depression (36:48)

When you zoom out, you look at it from a bird's eye view from the creator standpoint. That is what we are here for as humans. We're here to live and to pass on our DNA, our genetics, and to die. And I don't find that depressing. Some people might. What about you? I mean, for me, I actually like it. I just like the simplicity of it because you can play the game of life. You can go so deep that you try to complicate everything, but it's good to also like have it be simple like hey i'm here just to create create can be create kids it can be create great resources for for whoever for myself it can be create and help others can be create art can be create anything but it's like hey i'm here to create let me just let's just get to work right but i love i love just the hey all of this doesn't matter all that matters is like hey let's survive and let's have some kids and let's provide for them and let's let's have an impact um when you try to like get caught up into the like hey i need this i need, I need to achieve this status level. Like, it's a game that never ends, and that's where you end up in the riot race because then you start competing on things that don't necessarily matter.

Depression and success (38:14)

You can make it matter in your mind, but it's like it's not worth it. Because, you know, I'm not sure if you guys have ever noticed this, but, like, no matter how many goals you set for yourself and how many you achieve there's always something else to go after right so if you don't have a something to go back to that's like the actual like the north star of what really matters then that's where a lot of people end up depressed because it's like so i think a lot of people you know have this misconception that like when you end up being successful financially that you somehow tap into this state of like eternal happiness or that you end up in this state of eternal like contentment i don't think it works like that but the most fulfilled people are people with no desires right because if you don't have a desire you're actually you're you're wealthy you're you're you're you're blessed right so by understanding that like the main reason why we're here is those just two basic things like hey just survive and recreate then it gives you this little like baseline of knowing that like hey whatever whatever happens whether i build a company whether it fails whether it's this like those things are just to keep me busy and just to keep me like entertained and while i go through this life but a lot of people associate their identity to this and when breaks then they break right but if but if you really like keep it simple, then it's like, hey, I'm gonna do this. I'm gonna try a bunch of shit. I may fail. I may make a billion. Hey, who cares? Let's go. Right? So it just also like, it reduces the pressure, the pressure of like, oh, I need to be, I always need to be the best. I always, nah, nah. For me, I'm not, I'm cool.

Marriage (40:01)

I'm cool, whatever. Why is it so dangerous for entrepreneurs to make their business their whole identity? Do you mind sort of just breaking that down a little deeper? I love the way how you said like they just break. Can you kind of, do you have an example? Do you have an anecdote of some, like you've seen that in the industry before? So why is it dangerous for? Okay, yeah. I mean, I can try to repeat it. I don't know if I have an exact thing that I can use, but I can try to explain it. Cool. So we were talking about the fact that the main two things that really we're here for is like, you know, survive and then recreate. Right. And then we create all these games to try to be able to fulfill these two outcomes by, you know, starting businesses, by going and getting a degree, by going and trying to be, you know, maybe become a president or all these things. Right. maybe become a president or all these things, right? But a lot of people along the journey of trying to succeed at these games, the game becomes the outcome or it becomes their North Star. Succeeding at the game becomes their why, right? But the issue is that it's a game. So games, you fail. Sometimes you win, right? But most of the time you fail a lot more than you win. So when you forget to remind yourself why you're doing the thing in the first place, then you end up failing in business, succeeding in business. Actually, the worst thing is when you really win a lot and then you fail. Then when you do fail, when you've had constant wins it will break you because your whole identity is is based on the fact that you're a winner in business you're successful at your job you're this and that or maybe like you know you're like hey i'm a my goal is to like get married and like just focus on this well it's like no marriage is not necessarily the goal either marriage is also a social construct the goal is to recreate right you can be married not married no who cares recreate right so when you get attached to these games to these little social constructs then your identity as soon as the thing does not work it's almost like a vehicle as long as the assume when you attach your identity to the vehicle that you're in and that vehicle like breaks then you also break mm-hmm so it's really like removing separating yourself from the vehicle that gets you towards the goal and the actual goal itself if you don't mind search I'll leave it up to you obviously but relationships being one of those like five or six niches that pertain to everybody in the world like you said everyone doesn't want to be alone that's a really good one to kind of make a hook that's going to be very controversial and get a lot of views for so um your opinion on marriage you kind of just explained it like uh would you say that you think marriage is kind of like redundant like marriage is kind of like a fake construct um i wouldn't say that marriage is a fake construct but uh what we'll talk so you know the question before was um why should you not put your identity on uh on just on the thing you're doing on your business and attach it to that right which when you do that you forget that the reason why you're in business is because you want to accumulate a lot of resources and being able to provide for and attract a mate. Well, that led me to a thought process, which is like, well, if in, you know, if we follow the evolution of psychology thing, which is like the goal is to recreate because the gene wants to recreate itself. It does not care who you do it with. It just cares that it happens. Right. But now in society, society it's a we've built this marriage thing which is like hey you need to get married in front of the law and you need to sign all these things well I'm like no that's not really what our genes care about that's just as human it's probably human system it's probably the matrix right so I think that now side to that i actually believe in marriage but i'm not going to play the game of marriage and let's say if i get married and i don't like the marriage i'm not necessarily going to be like oh i'm locked into this forever like you know if it's not good it's not good it's if it's toxic it's toxic it's just a vehicle it's like hey we're trying to recreate ourselves so we can make babies so we can you know expand our genes but like if the vehicle is not good it's not good change it right yeah so that's that but like it's not a matter of like do it's not my belief it's just like if you think through logically is marriage, it's not a law of physics. It's not like, you know, it's not, it's not something that's written in, in like gravity, you know, it's just created by human. Probably they had other desires or other goals from that system because it's just a process. So Serge, being an entrepreneur and having the success that you've had, how do you find that the success that you've had has changed your criteria for a potential partner i don't think my success changes the criteria i think there are bigger bigger influences happening right now especially on social media i'm sure you guys have your socials but like you'll literally go on your explore page and there will be like a thousand beautiful women right so that's one that just messes you up right from the get-go right but the success thing um i think it just makes it easier for people to be like wanting to be with you right which creates a lot of option so it's really like the level of option you get is ridiculous, okay?

Relationships And The Impact Of Overwhelm

Choosing a partner (45:01)

But that also confuses you because a confused mind does not buy. Yeah, right? So that's really the issue is confusion. It's like, okay, then who do you choose? Yeah. If I compare that to, let's say, when I was in high school, I only liked this one girl and that was my target. i could care less because the amount of options that were there i'm not going to say there were a lot of more beautiful women but i was just i like this one girl but now it's like well if there is a thousand attractive women like then what do i judge that i like right is it physical like do i am i going to have to experience a thousand women to base it off of like oh i like right is it physical like do i am i going to have to experience a thousand women to base it off

The impact of overwhelm. (46:51)

of like oh i like you look good i also like your personality i also like this about you you like the same movie shows as me like like or like you know like it's like so i think it guys the the options man they mess you up so i would almost like to be like i think i'm gonna find my wife somewhere in the countryside just on a farm just zero option no internet you're certainly one girl this on this in this town so okay let's go that's beautiful i love that do you want to go into make a little bit about how like it also creates a lot of what-ifs and buyers remorse like it's like if you go to a restaurant there's three items on the menu and you get something, they actually did a study on it. You can mention that too. But there was a study where they had people go to an ice cream store and when there was three flavors, vanilla, chocolate, and strawberry, 90% of the people who got a flavor were happy with it and they weren't really wondering, did I make the right decision? And they were even thinking like, even if I don't, I'll go back and get option two or three next time. Whereas when you're overloaded with 50 options or a hundred options, no matter what decision you make, there's a 99 out of a hundred percent chance that you probably made the wrong decision. Yeah. Right. Yeah. It happens. It happens a lot. I mean, you know, like just the exact thing you mentioned, you go to a cafe, even Starbucks, you look at the Starbucks menu, you're just like, should I get a oat macchiato? Should I like, what, you know? And then sometimes you get a drink and you're like, I don't know if that was the one I wanted, you know?

Like each other (47:49)

Yeah. It's a very- You know what, I think it's actually a terrible idea to compare mating to food. So let's cut that topic out of there. I think we should live in it. I mean, on the longer part, we should definitely live in it. Yeah, I do really like, though, what you were saying about, like, you open up your Instagram and you're just kind of flooded with the algorithm feeding you thousands of pictures of potential, you know, mates, suitors, whatever. I think it's gamified dating in a really negative way where you become desensitized to people, right? It's like, if you have a thousand options in front of you, you never actually put the effort into taking any one of them really seriously because you feel like you have to get through so many. I think, uh, I think dating hookup culture is actually, um, I think hookup culture is kind of the matrix for, for young men and for, for entrepreneurs, especially. I think itup culture is kind of the matrix for young men and for entrepreneurs, especially. I think people were much happier when their options were offline, right? Yeah, I totally agree. You know, I mean, happened to me personally. I just, I ended up with a woman that, you know, it's like, I didn't have, I didn't have anything. Like I was, uh, I was really not in a good place. And, you know, this was an off, like offline, totally organic meeting the way we had a friendship, uh, you know, the way we, we just ended up sticking together through the hardest stuff, um, and, and growth and everything. It's like, I feel like if, if we didn't didn't end up, there were many times where I felt like we could have just broken up because it was just, it was too hard. Between long distance relationships, just some pretty serious fights and me just not having my shit together eight years ago, nine years ago, 10 years ago, whatever it was, I feel like it could have easily happened, but for whatever reason it didn't. And I feel like if things didn't work out with her, I feel like, uh, I would, I would be in a, I've thought about this a lot, how I'm really not a fan of the dating culture nowadays and how I feel like I'd have a really hard time with that. If I was looking, like if I was single and looking for a potential partner, I would probably just like hate doing like, you know know going on these apps or like whatever it is that you know people are doing to meet people nowadays and uh and yeah and i think i probably would honestly just be building and sometimes i think about it that way too because i'm like would things be different and then i'm like well you know she's a rock star in the business so i don't think it's like that but you know with uh yeah there's uh there's definitely a lot to think about there and i do definitely agree with what serge was saying about when there's less options it's almost easier you're just like great i pick you and and you know i'm happy there's not many flavors on the menu no no woman wanted to be with me at that time you know i didn't have a lot of options it's like nick you're married so you're already in the safe zone but serge do you not feel an urgency then to find a partner sooner rather than later? Because the more success you see, the more skepticism you're going to face for you for the right reason and the more options you're going to have, right? So do you not feel like you need to find someone now? But the thing is, like, finding that someone, I don't think it's a I don't it's not like a I mean I guess you can put yourself in a position to have more opportunities to finding them But I also don't like the like oh, I'm gonna find them right? I think it has to be organic It has to be something that you're not even like like looking for mm-hmm Cuz cuz I don't want someone who's like hey, I'm to find like a wife. Right. And then you're like, okay, I like this. I like this about you. Okay, cool. You meet the criteria. No, it's like, let me spend some time. Let me meet people. And then at some point, I'm going to find someone who I don't want to leave. And then I'm going to be like, okay, cool. I think you're the right one. So now on the thing of like, you know, what are they here for? Like, are they here because I'm financially in a good position? Maybe because I can offer them whatever. I mean, that's a tricky thing because you never know. And if you're already successful, you will never know. So it's like you'll never know unless you just you just go broke but for me a lot of the time and this is something that I do is I try to not lead with my socials when I'm meeting women just generally because I wanted not necessarily because I don't want them to see like my success but because I first want to see who they are and if I like them without them knowing who I really am mm-hmm and that way it just creates an organic like I just want it to be organic like let's talk what do you like you

Paul article (52:33)

know like yeah we'll talk about some weird stuff because I'm not all about business anyway like most of the time I'm not really all just talking about stuff because I also don't want to talk business with the person i'm with i just want to you know let's chill let's let's talk about other stuff in life so so i try not to lead with with with the success or whatever right so um so that also kind of like creates a little barrier i guess to them knowing so you can guess somewhat uh if they're authentic or just there for other reasons. Yeah, I totally agree. You know, it's like you need to, you don't need to be looking for it. You don't find someone when you're looking for them. It just happens. So I think that's a good perspective to have. And, you know, like you said, the options are there. So it's just whenever you feel like you're finding the the right person what's the dumbest purchase you ever made uh I don't know if I have ever made a dumb purchase because I'm uh I don't think I have I don't think I have I don't think I have cuz uh I'm uh I'm someone who doesn't I'm not I'm not a like a impulse buyer at least like on material stuff right okay i don't i really don't the only i mean it could be what would be dumb because i bought it because i actually liked it so it could be like maybe cars i'll like look at a car the night before and i'll go buy it by 12 p.m the next day type of thing but um but i wouldn't it's an impulse buy but it's not a dumb buy because it's for me for me cars it's like an experience right so if i want it i'm gonna i'm gonna get it i don't know how but i'm gonna get it type of thing so those would be like dumb buys because every car like even the first time i ever bought my first car it was like a five thousand dollar car but i didn't have five grand in my bank account right so but like i was like i'm gonna leave with this car today so i came in i was like hey how are we gonna make this work okay i put like 1500 bucks down uh but like i had to call like the bank and get the loan for the remaining amount no for the 5k so i can pay the guy off but like i did not plan that out just that day right so when it comes to those things i like i'll do it because i want it but uh anything else i don't i don't like buy dumb if it makes me happy i'll do it okay what's the most expensive purchase you've ever made um i guess just cars yeah yeah It's not a bad thing.

What cheapest youve made. (54:52)

Yeah. But yeah, I did, you know, I do feel like that's true with Serge.

Playing. (55:08)

I don't feel like he's a guy that, you know, like just frivolously spends. Like I feel like, you know, you're very simple. You know, I feel like you could be super flashy. Like I feel like, you know, you could do a lot with whatever, your wardrobe, watches, anything. But I don't see any of that on Serge. And I find that people even below Serge's stage, like they'll be at like, you know, 90K a month, 100K a month, and they're like Lambo, like full of everything. You know what I mean? I'm like, you're kind of hustling backwards, bro. You know, because you're getting stuck, they're getting stuck in the rat race, like for real. And they're just in a trap. And that's, you know, the same type of train of thought that leads, you know, the highest paid athletes to be living paycheck to paycheck it's like the same is that exactly anything right it's like you have a little drop shipping business you're doing like 100k a month decent margins and then you just you're like literally inflating your lifestyle to the point that you don't even have anything to like to fall back on it's like what if Shopify pulls the plug on you tomorrow or like what if you know it's like these are real risks yeah yeah that's that's one of the most important thing that a lot of people don't understand especially when you start making money and for me i guess because i was so focused on working that i didn't get into the habit of like just getting into the the the habit of wanting to look look like where i'm at in business wise like Like I didn't want to make, I didn't want my image to look how I was performing in business.

Money Dilemmas And Productive Financial Habits

Difficult days (56:22)

So I didn't get into that habit. So even if I would like make, you know, a lot of money every month, you know, like I moved out when I was already making like maybe like over almost half a million a year. Right. And I got my first, I was still driving a Mazda when I was making over a hundred K a month right and and a lot in that I can't I'm not gonna lie to you that oh my god like today if I had like increased my lifestyle back then mm-hmm today I would not be able to make the game play the games I'm playing because what that allows you to do is it allows you to go through periods of time where you're making shit ton more money than what you're spending. Okay? Absolutely. And then you end up with a lot more money than you need to go cover the expenses of the business, to cover everything, your team and everything like that. So then it's like if we have a month where, you know, maybe I don't make money, I'm'm like we're still making decisions as if we're making a million dollars a month because because i have the capital to cover anything if anything happens right but when you go because business is never just linear right you it's always like it's up and down ups and down and then it's even if it's not up and down it's always like you all go up and then you maintain and then you plateau or maybe you dip a little bit until an another building phase and then you go up again and then so it's all these little you know ink steps so if you increase your lifestyle all throughout the thing well when you plateau the expenses also go up and if you you kept rising your lifestyle like lifestyle and business expenses are two different things but like your lifestyle is going to creep up like your lifestyle expenses like go crazy when you when you don't understand that like hey the future may not be as bright as it is today so chill out on trying to look rich you're not you're not you're not rich like chill right you know so yeah yeah i'm curious to hear from both of you guys on that point as seven to eight figure entrepreneurs, what's the funniest thing you guys cheap out on? Because I have a friend, for example, who's making multiple seven figures and he still takes the bus 40 minutes to the discount gym. Right. And myself, for example, funny thing i cheap out on is i am so cheap with uber eats i only order uber eats from the buy one get one menu and when i have a 40 to 50 off coupon right so i'm buying 50 worth of food i'm getting 20 off of that with my 40 coupon and they're giving me a hundred dollars because it's buy one get one so i'm getting a hundred dollars of food for 20 to 30 dollars every time i use Uber Eats. And if I can't, I'm not ordering on Uber Eats.

Stuff you dont buy (59:08)

So I'm curious about you guys. What's some funny things that you guys cheap out on as multi-million entrepreneurs? I actually do that Uber Eats thing too. I need that Uber Eats thing because I spend way too much money on Uber Eats. I need that two Eats thing because I spend way too much money on Uber Eats. I need that two for one. Yeah. You know, like I'm somebody that I like to spend. I know what I like to spend on. And it's usually experiences. I really enjoy travel. So those are things I don't. And I feel like with other things that are not as important, I try to just generally find the balance between enjoying life to the fullest and not feeling like I'm holding back, but also just like frugality, right? Because to Serge's point, it's like, I don't want to spend as much money as I'm making or like, I want to have, like, that's how you, that's how you, you know, fumble the bag when it comes to building wealth. Facts. So I, like for me, it's like, I want to keep as many of my expenses like as low as possible. I won't cheap out on having a nice place to live. I won't cheap out on having experiences. If I'm with my friends and we're having a good time, I'm not I'm not going to be the person that's like, no, I don't want to go to this place. It's too expensive. Right. Like I want to enjoy that time with people. But, you know, I would say for as I'm getting older, too, I'm finding that just like there's so many things that maybe as a young person, I thought it was cool to spend money on that. And I'm like, no, I don't even you know, I don't even want to do that anymore. Like I I don't currently have a car. You know, my wife has a 09 Civic and I rent whenever I need to go somewhere and I want to, you know, pull up feeling like a million bucks. I'll just like I'll go rent a car from whatever exotics. And, you know, there's like a place in Vancouver, they've got like a Rolls Royce chauffeur. Sometimes I'll get driven around for a night, go for a little date night. But, you know, it's like, I don't own that because I'm owning a depreciating asset. And, you know, if you're in Serge's position, like be my guest, you know, but I'm not, I'm not in his position. And so I want to, I want to cut as much as I can down. You know, even with groceries, like I'll look at what's on sale. You know, it's like, sometimes it's not what I, what I feel like having. I'm just like, okay, well, this is on sale. I'm going to pick this up, you know? So, yeah. Yeah. For me to, it's a, cause I'm not, I'm not a big, a big like I don't it's not like I do a lot of stuff I don't buy a lot of stuff. So I don't know what I cheap out on just I just don't buy shit Yeah, so I guess it's I guess for me. It's not that I cheap out on stuff. It's just I just don't consume much Right. So like right now if you ask me that question I wouldn't be able to tell you like oh I cheap out on this because maybe like you know clothing or like like uh materialistic stuff like watch and things like that i will not buy those things because for me like if i look at like the cost of it i'm like wow this is this like if i spend 20 grand on a watch or 50 grand i mean that's like almost like a quarter of a million revenue that can be brought in if i spend that on marketing or on the team so i look at

Good things to spend your money on (01:02:30)

it that way and it keeps me from overspending um but when i want something i want it you know like it's you know like you know like he was saying like the place i live in it's like hey i work from here so like it better be the best place ever i like cars i like you know go and get my bagel and my little 500 horses car i'm gonna get the 500 horse the car like i don't care if it's expensive or not because i also remind myself that at the end of the day it's not as much as we want to create wealth as much as we want to do all these things you also don't want to sacrifice your life just to be financially also comfortable because then okay what's the point of you like stacking hundreds of millions of dollars like your kids will not need hundreds of millions they might not even need a million you know go they need to go make their own right so for me it's more of like a hey i'm here to also be selfish let me live the best life you know like if i travel with my team and we go to spain like we'll spend ridiculous amounts of money spending 10 grand a night on on just on accommodations and then we'll we'll go outside and drink or and go celebrate life we'll hire all these things i'm not looking at the price of that because that's what i'm successful for i'm successful so i can have memories that are crazy right so i work hard so that i don't have to look at the price tag of anything yeah that i want and then i just reduce my consumption rate to the things that i need like if i need a new shirt okay i'll go just buy a new shirt cool like hey i don't have anything to wear today okay cool let me. Let me go rock this. Um, but like, besides those things, like I try to buy only the things I need and I want, and it's going to be that. Yeah. Yeah. You know, um, that kind of brought me back to just thinking about, we were talking about mimetic desires, but you know, it's like that, that brings me back to, you saw someone else that bought a Rolex, you know, they made their first mill and they're like, yeah, you know,'s like that that brings me back to you saw someone else that bought a rolex you know they made their first mill and they're like yeah you know i got this rolex and then like do i actually want to have that watch would i like to own that thing or it's like i saw somebody else doing that and i felt like you know oh they did this so i need to do this or i need to show other people that i'm successful and this is the only way i can get that validation that i'm actually successful if i own this watch or whatever right and it's like well you have to ask yourself like is that is that actually important for you like deep down do you feel important when you achieve that milestone does it make you genuinely happy and if the answer is yes then then fucking do that thing but if the answer is like you know maybe not really then you know and and I think I think that's so important to understand for for any person it's like what actually makes you happy? And it's like, for someone else, it might be cars or watches or whatever their thing is. But it's like, if it's not yours, then you don't need to do that. And you're probably going to put yourself in debt. Or at least, like you said, there's an opportunity cost with where could that money be better spent if I just used it or saved it for something more important. Like where could that money be better spent if I just used it or saved it for something more important? And that ties into another thing we were talking about, which is delayed gratification, which, you know, you kind of brought up inadvertently with the Mazda thing, right? Because it's like 100K a month. Like a lot of people just go get a Lambo. They go get a, you know, and they want to show it off and they want to be on Instagram. Look at all this money I'm making and showing all their poor friends like what a great job they're doing right um and so how how do you feel like delayed gratification has changed your life uh i mean i think it's it's what allows me to have space to to to to become better you know because you cannot build a great organizations a great organization while trying to survive impossible in like it's super impossible because here is the thing that most people don't understand in order for you to build a seven-figure company you need to build a platform that delivers seven figures worth i mean more than seven figures worth of value right in order to make eight figures you need to build a more than seven figures worth of value, right?

Steven: Delay gratification (01:05:35)

In order to make eight figures, you need to build a thing that generates 10 times more value. If you want to make a billion, you need to build a platform that will generate maybe trillions worth of value. Now, do you really think that you're going to build a seven-figure company in two days or even a month, even 30 days? No, you're not not do you think you're gonna build an eight figure company in one year maybe not even those who do go from zero to ten mil a year they probably spent a decade becoming better to be able to sustain that growth and handle that type of pressure mm-hmm so when you delay gratification what it allows you to do at least financially like buying stuff that you what it allows you to do at least financially like buying stuff that you want it allows you to just be to not level up your your your costs and it allows you to just be like hey for the next year I could literally not make any money and I will still be cool to be able to survive and take care of everything that I need to take care of to survive and then build because then it I need to take care of to survive, and then build. Because then it allows you to, it gives you space to think. It turns you into someone that no one can compete with. Because the reason why most people can't scale companies is because they're in a rush. Like any problem that you're facing, that I'm facing, that you're facing, has already been solved. But the reason why we're not solving it is because we're trying to build an eight-figure company while still trying to make a million dollars a year mmm does not work it does not work you got to stop the million-dollar activities bullshit activities and be like hey okay cool who can who can come in and take care of this million dollar activities okay cool now I need to spend 60 days finding talent oh when i get the talent he may not actually all be ready he needs 30 days 60 days 90 days to be onboarded oh i need to to train him every day meet him with him set up targets and everything okay cool then he'll actually start producing 96 in the third um in the second quarter well now the person is making a million dollars. When you tell him that, hey, you have to wait six months, 12 months to even be able to remove yourself from this, they're like, no, fuck that. I'm going to make a VSL. I'm going to do a webinar. I'm going to run the ads myself. I'm going to do this. So I think it's about like you need to delay gratification. And, you know, one of the things I always talk about is like, hey, I want a GT3, right? I always post on my stories like I need a Porsche I need a Porsche yeah is it because I can't get a Porsche no no right but but but you know and I always catch myself thinking like bro why are you always talking about this dumb ass car gt3 Porsche let's say it's a quarter of a million or 300 grand mm-hmm well okay cool I could go get it maybe I won't find the allocation but I GT3 Porsche, let's say it's a quarter of a million or 300 grand. Well, okay, cool. I could go get it. Maybe I won't find the allocation, but I could go get it tomorrow if I wanted to. But there's also a second layer to delaying gratification where it's like it almost puts something to look forward to. So it almost gives me that thing that I want. Then I lie to myself like, oh, I'm working hard so I can get this car. No, it's not that. I could go get the car, but it's like, I lie to myself and create these fake goals to just keep me waking up. I'm like, wow, when I do get that Porsche, it's gonna be nice. So it's almost like it puts a little light at the end of the tunnel, and it's just like a little prize, because if you don't have things to look forward to when you're building a company man it is so hard it is so because i mean i guess some people are like hey i just do this because it's who i am no it's not who you are shut up like building a company is hard so you need to have something at the end of the day to look forward to maybe you're someone who likes watching movies i like chilling out at the end of the day. I like just ordering my food, eating, just watching a show. And I love to look forward to, oh, maybe I'm going to go to the movies. Maybe I'm going to buy a quarter of a million dollar car. Maybe I'm going to buy, I'm going to get into a penthouse, right? I could have moved into the home I'm in way earlier, but it's like, no, I just want it for it to be a milestone. If I make a half a million a month, I'm like, okay, fuck it. Now I think I deserve to live here. So it's like no i just wanted for it to be a milestone if i make a half a million a month i'm like okay fuck it now i think i deserve to live here you know so it's like i push things so far so that i can have something to look forward to and it kind of like creates this little like lie in my mind that i'm chasing something and it makes the pain feel less painful yeah yeah yeah and i i think that also ties in nicely to what we were just talking about knowing what the fuck you want because it's like if you put like if for example i say oh serge wants a gt3 that's my light at the end of the tunnel too like i'm gonna be and it's like if you if i don't really want that then i'm not gonna actually be motivated to wake up and do my thing because that's not not my desire.

Mat Gets Help (01:10:23)

Right. Um, and I think that's where just the knowledge of like what you actually want to get out of this, like what is the end goal? And, and then that's how you can, you know, kind of illustrate that timeline. Like, okay, when I hit this goal, this is what I'm going to get. And that actually makes me so excited. Not just like what someone else did or what someone else wants. Yeah. Serge, do you think that entrepreneurs should spend their money on courses or coaches? Yeah, I think they should. Yeah. And not necessarily because I think, so for me, this is the funny thing. I've probably bought less than like 10 courses or coaching programs like in the last three years right and now looking back could i have changed things yeah i could have probably bought more stuff you know work with mentors and things like that but i think that at first you need to realize that like you can try to go through it alone and try to just spend the time becoming good learning your own lessons or you could trade capital and just save time because at the end of the day and i think there's this little meme that has been going around which is like the more time you spend chasing the thing the more time you uh you waste not experiencing the thing right okay so like you have let's say you have 80 years to live if you try to take because there are some people will take 10 years 20 years to build a million dollar year business right but i'm like are you serious like are you dumb a decade 20 years to learn how to make 100 grand a month is stupid just just generally like dumb like like dumb equal dumb because you could have taken three months one month to go pay someone who's making that and look at their pricing model look at their offer look at their sales process look at the size of the team look at the fulfillment and just plug and play every single position fill in the gaps and then somehow you make a million dollars a year but for me i've tried not to to spend money on coaches and consultants or like courses and things like that because some a lot of people get lost into this habit of like just buying because i'm sure you've you've experienced that little um dopamine hit you get when you book up buying to something new you're like wow this is going to change my life for me i'm like no like i'm not going to wait for me to buy something to see that oh i need to actually be leveraged in my business oh what is this guy doing okay cool this is how he's marketing okay cool oh this is how many times he's marketing and putting out social proof okay i'm gonna do that i don't need to pay you to see i just i just look at you if i need something more you know back and wise operations wise then cool i'm gonna go find some free free material on podcasts if i still need help okay cool let me go see who is where i'm at let me pay him uh and even today like you know right now we're starting to work with a growth firm that's making like four million a month and like the reason why i'm paying them though is because i don't have time anymore to go learn. So like learning now becomes more of a cost. It's a bigger cost. I mean, not learning, but it's like learning on a big timeline. I just want to learn it in one week. Right. So I pay because I want to actually like shorten the timeline of learning. The rate of learning. Right. I want to increase it the time line of learning, the rate of learning. I want to increase it. So that's why I would buy. So if you're someone who has more money than time, then just pay to learn faster. I'm definitely guilty of the little dopamine rush thing you talked about. I don't believe in time is money and money is time. I believe time is money, but I don't think money is time, right? Because with time you can make money, but money will never get you more time. Money can compound. You can acquire more money. You can never compound your time. You can never acquire more time. And so I've spent $40,000 on coaching and mentorship this year. Wow. And although it's the best investment I've made, I will definitely say, I think a lot of the although it's the best investment i've made i will definitely say i think a lot of the time it's that little dopamine hit that people are chasing to just feel like they're doing something productive what i'll say on the other end of that though as soon as i spend that money even if i don't learn anything from the course or even if i don't even go into it i suddenly have a motivation where i'm like fuck i just spent 15 g's on this i need to make triple this money back and it pushes me to do something. But one thing I found out is this is how you can get 90% off online courses from gurus.

How to Save $9000 on Online Courses (01:15:07)

And this is how I saved $9,000 on a $10,000 course or got a $10,000 course for $1,000. A lot of people who are selling courses are not very technologically savvy. And when they build their websites, whether it's on Shopify or on SamCart or wherever else, oftentimes their URLs at checkout are very simply codified. And so I noticed once while purchasing a $10,000 course, I got on a sales call and the salesperson was telling me, sorry, I can't give you anything more than a $2,000 discount. It's the most I can do. I can give you this $10,000 course for 8,000. It's our absolute best price we can offer you. And I said, okay, send me the link because I was really interested in buying this course. And he sends me the link and I copied the link so I can send it from my iPad to my computer. And I noticed the URL has at the end of it, course XYZ dash checkout dash coupon code seven. So I went to the seven and I changed that to six and then I changed it to five and then I changed it to four. And I tried every single number between one and 20 and I found coupon codes and checkout pages with everything from $1,000 off to $9,000 off that 10K course. I'm not saying I checked out with that $9,000 discount, but I got really curious by this and I tested it out with a number of other guru courses and it's crazy how many people have this loophole and this liability on their website for their course. So if you run a course and you're listening to this right now you should probably check up on your URLs yeah that's crazy I never never thought of that yeah yeah wild that's that's really interesting you know follow-up question to that surge is why do you think that people buy courses and then don't get the end result that they expected to get?

Handling Success And Trauma

Why People Never End Up Getting Success With Courses (01:16:54)

Well, I mean, that's pretty simple. So there is this thing, I mean, Hormozzi calls it the definition of intelligence. I call it the growth formula, right? So like, hey, what creates growth? Well, we'll do intelligence first. An intelligent person acquires a new input, a new data, a new insight, and then they change their behavior. Right? And a super genius person does that but does it way faster. Right? right well if you look at also what creates growth in in someone's life is they learn something new and they learn a lot of it faster and then on the other hand on the second variable is they also change their behavior faster than ever right when you buy a course you will learn I mean if you're disciplined enough to sit down and actually put on headphones and watch the thing or listen to the thing or the book whatever um but the thing they forget is that your behavior your rate of change of your behaviors needs to be as equal to the rate of learning a lot of people forget this and i promise you you, and to be honest, the thesis of my company is this.

These 2 Things Help Business & Life. (01:18:05)

People just keep on learning bullshit. They're like, hey, they're so smart. You're like, okay, you already know it. So as an example, let me say this. A Facebook ad media buyer or an ad person who's making 500K a year, you're going to tell him like like hey you this is what you need to do and then they'll be like oh this is what you need to do to get five mil a year and they'll be like oh yeah I already know how to do it okay then the fuck then the difference between you making 500k a year and you not making five mil is your rate of execution mmm right so I've literally created our program around hey we're not just going to give you the rate of learning we're not going to just change that variable but we're also going to help you execute faster so when someone works with us it's like we look at every single thing that needs to be put in place and we put in place for them and then we just get them to manage the new thing because for me it's like selling courses a little tricky for me uh it's not that i will never sell courses i will right but for a higher level like more expensive thing 15 grand 25 grand 30 grand 50 grand what we're selling is not really information anymore it's just like hey let's help you just move faster and let's just do things for you so you don't so you don't get stuck in this loop of like just like mental masturbation of you becoming't so you don't get stuck in this loop of like just like mental masturbation of you becoming smarter but not becoming richer you know absolutely yeah it's a big problem so yeah just those two things changes changes changes everything once you understand that right yeah yeah that's a a really good point because you know there's uh there's people that do get into that loop of like i'm buying courses i'm reading books i'm learning i'm learning i'm doing all this it's like all in my brain and i feel you feel good it's kind of like a dopamine boost right like you're like wow i'm so i'm learning i'm learning something new but it's like what are you changing about what you're doing now are you actively changing your beliefs are you actively changing your behaviors and your actions and your your inputs and outputs that are coming out on a daily basis i think often that's where the disconnect is it's like you're learning but it just stops there it's like there's nothing that changes past that yeah or you just do it or you just change your behavior but you just change it once right yeah i think everyone has to go through that at some point that kind of loop of mental masturbation because it's it's less scary than trying the hard thing that you know your ego is worried that you might fail. And I think for a lot of people, you don't even realize you have that fear. When I started operating a business and trying to scale a business, I had no awareness whatsoever that I had that fear. And I think for different people, and we'll probably cut this part out, but I think everyone has to go through that mental masturbation and it just takes people different amounts of time to get that mental nut where they can finally then get into doing the work. You know? Yeah, for sure. I think you just need to get tired of your own bullshit. That's fair. Yeah. Until you're tired of just like, just staying in the same position, then like you don't, you will just stay in the same position. You know, you just need to get pissed off off like what the fuck is going on yeah absolutely like i deserve more and then then you change it's true yeah yeah i think uh you know that that also just ties back to knowing knowing yourself like why is that goal important for me is it just a number is it a number i'm trying to hit like you know am i trying to get make my first 10k a month because that's what every person online is preaching. Make my first 100k make a million a month. Is it a number? Or is that actually important to me? Do I need to hit this goal for a reason? And I think if you can, if you can justify that, and put a real reason behind that I need to make this work so that I can feed my team, I can hire the best people, I can deliver the best results, I can be the best in my space. If you genuinely feel that passion coming through, then, you know, you will get tired of your own bullshit. Cause I'm like, why am I not there yet? I should have been there decades ago or I had the information. I knew what I was supposed to do and I didn't do it. So what's wrong with me? You know? Yeah. Nick, we had that conversation earlier in the car about how like Mosey, for example, breaks down, like the large part of the formula for success is trauma and how much trauma you went through, like going through the right amount. Right. Do you mind asking Serge, like, what role do you think trauma plays in your success as an entrepreneur? Okay. What role do you think that trauma plays in your success as an entrepreneur? Um, you know, we're talking about this, right? Um, yesterday you asked me something, which, you know, I gave you an answer to. We're not going to talk about it here, but, um, I think everyone to, to have these big, big, gigantic goals, you're, you're doing it because you're trying to fill in a gap.

What Role Does Trauma Play in Your Success As An Entrepreneur? (01:22:58)

Like no matter how people push position it, like every really successful person has a really big thing that they're trying to fill up right so I generally believe they're like every person who's really successful has gone through something that has had to change the way that they treat life because someone who's successful means they take their time seriously they take their their their existence seriously and they give it a cause. They have a mission. Now, if you never had any trauma or anything serious happen in your life, then you're just here to just have orgasms and just have fun. It's like you're just here to be comfortable and just be like, hey, I'm going to just eat. I'm going to get a little bit enough to survive. I'm going to just get just a little bit of that. So it's like the the standard need to be really fucking high for your life in order for you to become successful because the price to pay to be successful for someone who's had everything good all their life is not actually worth it in my opinion i think not entrepreneurship is not meant for everyone in my opinion because you've you need to be it's a sacrifice that only you need to have lost so much that the the sacrifice that you have to go through for success compared to what you've lost is still nothing right and i think that that's what makes it easy because then you have more context you're like oh i'm gonna have to spend two years buildings i'm gonna have to spend five years buildings i may not go see family this week i may not answer you when you call me i may prioritize this thing more than my relationships I may prioritize this more than my health right mm-hmm and I may be more serious with the people that I love because there are standards to follow in order for me to accomplish this mission but for someone who has no context then cutting out people sacrificing your weekends not drinking not smoking weed not chasing a thousand women becomes a sacrifice that is not really worth it because they shit that the shit you're going to eat building a company is relatively like, okay, cool, whatever. That's nothing. Let's do it. Yeah. Yeah.

Where the healthy F.E.A.R. Comes From (01:25:33)

I feel like a good kind of a good example of why this is true, I think, is when you look at people who come from you know good families with money i think like if you if you look at those kids right it's like uh you know no disrespect but i i just feel like they just don't have it in them they don't have it in them to go through the trenches because they've always had it good they've always been comfortable and typically they'll end up in some kind of corporate you know typically high-ish paying job uh and they they just have the comfort of like yeah well my parents have money and I have a house and when they die, I'm going to inherit their shit. And, and they don't really feel that, that need to be that change maker, that person that comes in and breaks the cycle because they, what cycle are they breaking? Right. It's like, my parents already achieved all this and, you know, they'll, they'll just always feel like a shadow. And, and it's like, they just listen listen your parents are their parents are like yeah go be go to school and uh and study and become a doctor they're like okay i'll do it like you know they just they're compliant and they don't challenge beliefs like we were talking about earlier they're just like well you know my parents are obviously smart and like whatever it is what it is yeah um not saying it's not possible but i do you know i do see many successful people who have hard backgrounds and I, and I, you know, typically I'm not seeing a lot of people who came from, from wealthy family backgrounds who are going through the trenches because they just, they've never done that. They just don't know what, what that means, you know? Yeah. Nick, do you, would you say that having a life partner, would you say that getting married has removed the FOMO from entrepreneurship for you like remove the FOMO as in uh Sturge kind of talked about a second ago like when you were in entrepreneurship and for a lot of people it's just not worth it to give up like you know going out and going on a lot of dates and having a lot of experiences going to oh I got you okay okay do you feel like having found a life partner this early in your journey has made it easier to go through entrepreneurship?

Romantic Relationships and Focus. (01:27:05)

Um, yeah, I mean, it's a good question. I think like it's, it's pros and cons, like everything, you know what I mean? It's like, I think, uh, pros it's yeah. I mean, I, I don't, if I'm not going out, you know, it's like, what am I missing out on? I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna go out. I'm not looking for anyone. I'm not looking for anything. If I want to go out, it's with my friends that I already know. And you know, it's like, I don't do that much, honestly, outside of outside of work, go to the gym, I jump in the ocean, I come out, you know, I get back to work. So that said, like that can be seen as a pro because I'm focused, I'm dialed in, and she's with me on the journey. So it's like, I feel like I'm not building for myself. It's like, I'm building for us. I'm building for our future. I'm building so that we can have experiences together. And that's very motivating to have someone beside me. And I can see like, you know, how hard she's working. And I'm just like, well, shit, like, you know, it's like, I gotta, I gotta make this work for both of us. And I, there's a kind of a good pressure on me in that respect um so I wouldn't say it's like a FOMO thing I think it's more honestly just like I find that it can be it can be something that's difficult right because it's like you look at a couple like Alex and Layla and it's like Layla they love they just love working like maybe to a greater extent like I don't know if we're like that I don't know if we're like that. I don't know if we're fully like that. We're kind of like that. But it's like, sometimes I'm like, I wish I could just hit the off button. Like, ideally, my motivation is to have her just focus on her art, because I think that's ultimately what she would really like to do. And I know that's what really excites her in life. She's an artist. She studied drawing and painting, and she's really good at it, you know? And it's like, it's one of those things that, you know, when you're coming up and you're trying to have that stability in life, it's like, how do you focus, right? It's like Serge said something earlier about, you know, just like when you're building, it's like you can't, when you're in scarcity mode, how do you build a great business? You don't build a great organization. It's the same thing as with anything, right? Art, making art in that way is a business. And it's like, you can't really take risks that you need to take if you're just like struggling paycheck to paycheck, or if you're working another job in order to make art and whatever. And that's why we chose this path because we were both on a different path to maybe going more of a creative route. But, you know, we ended up going down this path for the freedom and for the ability to do whatever we want. And that's a very deep, authentic desire that, you know, is important to us. And so I love what you just said about the scarcity mindset applying to everything, including art, because I got into entrepreneurship because of art as well. I wanted to be a musician growing up and I got to an age where I suddenly started needing to support myself financially, but I wanted to dedicate all my time to music. So my mindset with music shifted from creating for the joy of creating to, I need to learn how to make money off this now right and so following trends and sergey touched on this again you want to play the game your own way not like how other people play it to win necessarily but when you start making music or making any form of art in order to make a living and you have that outcome tied to it now you're outcome dependent it loses it's no longer a passion it's not a hobby it's like yeah it's survival and i ended up quitting music multiple times because i got to a point where i was completely uninspired and i realized to myself i need to find another source of income and put music on the side completely and scale this and create a real source of income for myself so that I can go back to music from a place of abundance and not scarcity. Yeah, absolutely. That's like, in my opinion, that's the only way to do it. Cause I tried it the other way and it wasn't, it wasn't it. It's like, if you want to get good at your craft, it's like, okay, well you need to buy expensive supplies. You're going to be struggling to buy those supplies. It's like, you want to maybe get mentorship or, or take some classes or something like that. And it's like, you want to maybe get mentorship or take some classes or something like that. And it's like, you're not able to do that. You can't build anything great from a place of scarcity. And that's why it didn't work. And that's why, you know, I would, I would like ideally for us to get to a place where we're comfortable, you know, and we've delegated everything and I can just let her go in a, in a good way. I'd be like, you're removed from this. You don't need, like, we did this together and like, I'm very proud of this, but it's like, if, if you want to go, like, there's no obligation to be here. Like, you know, because we, we've, we've made a scalable process. We've made a system that allows us to rely on the talent of others who are more talented than us and more skilled than us. Cause I know those people are out there. Right. And that's the goal as a business owner. You don't want to be owning a job. You want to be owning a company, right? Yeah.

The importance of mental health as entrepreneurs (01:32:09)

Nick has some really, a big part of entrepreneurship, I think, is often overlooked is the mental health aspect, right? And Nick has some great stories. All three of us, I'm sure, have been through it. But being at a point where you're not only relying on yourself as an entrepreneur like you need to make that money to feed your employees and they come before you right like you like stories of like having to pull out a loan or or take out put the rest of your credit limit on paying a staff member before you pay for your own groceries uh sirs you might asking nick a question related to leading into like like mental health as an entrepreneur, so that he can kind of talk about that a little bit? Um, how? Uh, saying something like, um, saying something along the lines of, uh, what angle do you want to talk about this from Nick? Do you want to kind of talk about that financial angle of like that pressure? Do you want to talk about relationship pressure? What's the biggest pressure you've had as an entrepreneur in your life? Mental health wise. You could even just start with a, with a, with a statement and then you can play off it. You can even just say like, um, mental health is often overlooked in entrepreneurship. Like this shit is hard. It's not easy. It takes a toll on you, you know? Yeah. Just, just say it in a way that like you feel is like true to your beliefs and whatever yeah um you know running a company is sometimes i mean it can be lonely you're having to deal with situations where you have to choose between your own uh convenience and actually having to take care of maybe people like your team or you you know, having to choose between two hard choices. Like, what are some of the situations where you have had to kind of like make, you know, those hard decisions, but have to choose, you know, and not have to put yourself first? Right. Yeah, there's you know, there's certainly been times that have been tough. It's like in the in the beginning stages when you're really trying to grow and you're trying to make something beyond yourself. It's like now, you know, it's like going from that place where you're basically like a well paid freelancer. It's like now taking that and being like, I need to go pay someone else, train them, ensure that they're able to do whatever it is that I'm paying them to do. ensure that they're able to do whatever it is that I'm paying them to do. You know, like that has been a, that was something like early on that I, that I had a challenge with. Like I, first of all, I had a hard time even deciding like, what is the criteria? Like what do I need to look for in a person that I'm going to be hiring, especially a first hire or second hire? Cause that's pretty important. There's like the first time you're taking the company outside of yourself. You know, so it's like that decision-making and even just like thinking to yourself on a regular basis. Am I making the right decision? Did I choose the right person? Did I interview enough people? Did I like, am I looking for experience or what is it that I'm looking for? Right. So those are some things that were challenging. And even just from a financial standpoint, like trying to build when it's like you're early on and it's like having to pay people, like I've definitely maxed out my credit lines before needing to pay my staff first, before my own needs. And we made it through, but it's definitely, it can be a tough, you can be in a tough place financially where you're just like, okay, like what is going on here?

The Struggles Of Entrepreneurship

The challenges of being an entrepreneur (01:35:31)

You know, like, like, geez, like I'm, you know, I, and that's, that's like ultimately, I think people don't understand, right? They look at entrepreneurs like, oh my God, it's so easy. You guys make so much money and everyone wants to do it. It's again, a mimetic desire. But, you know, at the end of the day, it's like, are everyone wants to do it it's again a memetic desire but uh you know at the end of the day it's like are they willing to do that are they willing to go take out a loan or put you know like a salary on their credit card or credit line because they can't afford to pay it for the cash flow they have at the moment you know that's uh it's a pretty tough place to be in so yeah it definitely takes like takes balls to do to run a company. Oh, yeah. I think it's overlooked. It's overlooked a lot. We'll need to wrap up, guys. Yeah, I heard a knock. Okay, great. Cool. Yeah, I mean, it was a pleasure as always. I'm really glad that we were able to just chop it up and chat about business and life you know it's it's great it's great being here in in Montreal and you know it's yeah it's just it's always a pleasure yeah thousand percent man no I think she thanks for coming through and for dinner I think dinner last night was pretty good I think we got to talk about some cool stuff yeah and yeah man more of these some some in some different locations yeah definitely fun absolutely yeah I gotta I gotta come at you next time with with a big level up so let's go yeah you know you know how we do it yeah alright cool guys thank you so much thanks I think this was good you killed it and yeah You know how we do it.

Ending Teaser

Tease (01:36:24)

Yeah. All right, cool. Guys, thank you so much. Thanks. I think this was good. You killed it. And yeah, thanks for everyone for watching. Thanks, guys.